Education In Scotland

[Alan]

Declining further. Stats are poor. Postcode and family income big determination on future success.  John Swinney has no answers in interviews today.  At least kids from private school get free uni and don't need to worry about end of grants.

[Caledonian Craig]

20 minutes ago, Alan said:

Declining further. Stats are poor. Postcode and family income big determination on future success.  John Swinney has no answers in interviews today.  At least kids from private school get free uni and don't need to worry about end of grants.

Your point? SNP incompetence per chance?

Hope you look at the waiting times at A & E, waiting times for critical operations etc which in Scotland outdoes the rest of the UK.

And the state of prisons where prisons in England and Wales are touted for the whole prison system being on the point of collapse according to the prison wardens who man them.

[deecie]

10 minutes ago, Caledonian Craig said:

Your point? SNP incompetence per chance?

Hope you look at the waiting times at A & E, waiting times for critical operations etc which in Scotland outdoes the rest of the UK.

And the state of prisons where prisons in England and Wales are touted for the whole prison system being on the point of collapse according to the prison wardens who man them.

Deflect, deflect, deflect....

[Caledonian Craig]

Just now, deecie said:

Deflect, deflect, deflect....

No. Just evidence that Westminster governments that rule the UK and has done for over 300 years without any change to the system in a virtual two party society are even more incompetent.

[deecie]

1 minute ago, Caledonian Craig said:

No. Just evidence that Westminster governments that rule the UK and has done for over 300 years without any change to the system in a virtual two party society are even more incompetent.

Deflect further.

[killiefaetheferry]

Can anyone point out what the problem is ? Classroom sizes ? Teaching methods ? Discipline in schools ? Lack of parental involvement in their children's education ?

I would really like to understand this, but every media report is tainted with 'SNP BAD', or the SNP defending..................anybody with any insights please help out here ?

[Toepoke]

Heard a chap from the teachers' union putting it down to the extra effort they're having to put in implementing the curriculum for excellence. Reckons it will take a few years to come to fruition. A shortage of teachers isn't helping though.

[Caledonian Craig]

41 minutes ago, deecie said:

Deflect further.

Or counter-deflecting from Westminsters troubles with implementing Brexit etc Take your pick.

[Caledonian Craig]

4 minutes ago, Toepoke said:

Heard a chap from the teachers' union putting it down to the extra effort they're having to put in implementing the curriculum for excellence. Reckons it will take a few years to come to fruition. A shortage of teachers isn't helping though.

Quite possible. Sweeping changes will take time to come to fruition - no doubt. Judge in a few years time I reckon.

[killiefaetheferry]

So would the argument be that the 15 year olds tested were coming through the educational system without the benefits of being taught via the CFE ?

[Alan]

32 minutes ago, Caledonian Craig said:

Or counter-deflecting from Westminsters troubles with implementing Brexit etc Take your pick.

Please keep this to education. Our standards are falling.  Your retorts mirror government by obsessing with Westminster and taking eye off the ball.  The Curriculim For Excellence was kicked off by Labour and is still not stable.  9 years of power and will ultimately be 14.  Thats a full lifecycle of primary school and secondary school for thousands of kids. Geez oh.

Even though I did standard grades i wonder if return to O Grades would not be bad.

Might have to start saving for private education if the good post codes start to suffer.

[Larky Masher]

43 minutes ago, killiefaetheferry said:

Can anyone point out what the problem is ? Classroom sizes ? Teaching methods ? Discipline in schools ? Lack of parental involvement in their children's education ?

I would really like to understand this, but every media report is tainted with 'SNP BAD', or the SNP defending..................anybody with any insights please help out here ?

An over-bureaucratic system driven by the SNP's need to micromanage everything which creates too much administrative overhead for teachers and this is detrimental to the quality of teaching.

[Larky Masher]

35 minutes ago, killiefaetheferry said:

So would the argument be that the 15 year olds tested were coming through the educational system without the benefits of being taught via the CFE ?

Perhaps but they'd still have had all their teaching in a system run by an SNP government.

[Hertsscot]

Don't think the education system in England is much better.  Recruitment is a mess, £30,000 bursaries to attract people into the profession but not doing anything to tackle retention, loads of schools about to go into debt.  More kids coming into the system over the next few years and no idea where the teachers are going to come.  Then there's the ideologically driven free school fetish and grammar schools and academies and hideous lack of accountability.  Education in Scotland may need to improve but whatever the temptation don't look at the model south of the border!

[ParisInAKilt]

Education should start and end at home anyway. Schools only teach you the basics and not to question things. 

[Guest flumax]

http://www.eis.org.uk/public.asp?id=3495&dbase=2

 

Probably a fair point to follow. 

[Guest flumax]

Interesting to note it's a UK wide failing to 

https://amp.theguardian.com/education/2016/dec/06/english-schools-core-subject-test-results-international-oecd-pisa

[Och Aye]

2 hours ago, killiefaetheferry said:

Can anyone point out what the problem is ? Classroom sizes ? Teaching methods ? Discipline in schools ? Lack of parental involvement in their children's education ?

I would really like to understand this, but every media report is tainted with 'SNP BAD', or the SNP defending..................anybody with any insights please help out here ?

A sensible appeal mate but it'll be a political slanging match as per for a few weeks then forgot about until the next stats come out.

[Guest flumax]

Note that Scotland score 491 England N. Ireland score 493, Scotland 2 points lower at 491. A while 2 non sensical points lower. Meh 

 

Scottish education 99.6% of the score of England /NI... Hardly massively different. 

Sorry but I think this is likely statistical fluctuations. 

 

Wouldn't worry. 

 

But hay make it political 

[Larky Masher]

1 minute ago, flumax said:

Note that Scotland score 491 England N. Ireland score 493, Scotland 2 points lower at 491. A while 2 non sensical points lower. Meh 

 

Scottish education 99.6% of the score of England /NI... Hardly massively different. 

Sorry but I think this is likely statistical fluctuations. 

 

Wouldn't worry. 

 

But hay make it political 

But we're below Estonia, Vietnam, Ireland, New Zealand, Slovenia to name a few.

[Alan]

Who gives a flying about England for a devolved policy?  Our politicians are failing us.  I pray Swinney tries that excuse.  Our education is failing our children in a globalised world. 

[killiefaetheferry]

I admittedly have a vested interest here, as I am applying to re-train as a primary teacher, and currently work in child care (after school club etc) to gain experience. Been very impressed with the vast majority of people working in teaching, from play group right through to P7 ages. CFE is well regarded amongst those I have spoken to.Only one microcosm, but am currently seeing senior staff teaching classes as opposed to supply teachers covering for absence.

[Lamia]

#don'tfeedthetroll

[aaid]

2 minutes ago, Lamia said:

#don'tfeedthetroll

You could set your watch by him.

[Stapes]

Never heard of these figures before, which is strange given that when you compare 2000-2006 with 2009-2015, the former is infinitely worse for reading and maths. But then, the media didn't have an agenda before 2007 ...

Edited December 6, 2016 by Stapes