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Gordon Strachan


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6 hours ago, adamntg said:

I'd keep him regardless, seriously.  He gets the best out of not the greatest squad, don't think anyone else would.

Agree - the root problem with Scottish football remains youth development...
It has been that way since the 1990s!

Strachan has got the best out of an average crop of players.
Replacing him wont magically fix the problem - last 2 games we have started to look much better.

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18 hours ago, Parklife said:

Players like Armstrong and Fraser, who every one with a clue would've had in the team 18 months ago? 

Can't help but feel you're not being honest there.

It's easy to rate them both that highly with hindsight, but looking where they were 18 months ago:

Fraser had spent a season as a bit part sub for Bournemouth in the Championship, was deemed not up to it when they got into the premier league so was loaned out to Ipswich in the Championship. He played ok for them but spent most of the season out injured. Even if you'd wanted to call him up then you probably couldn't because he wasn't fit to play.

Armstrong was a fairly regular Celtic player, not pulling up trees and stuck out on the left with not a great influence in most games.

If you'd said that 18 months ago you wanted to call up Johnny Russell and Tom Cairney I'd probably believe you, but Fraser and Armstrong? I think both of them would have been incredibly surprised and assumed it was a practical joke if they'd got call ups then.

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14 hours ago, Doric said:

Sign him up on an extended contract now. There is no one else and he is getting the best out of the players again like he did when he first came.  Long term manager may well pay off instead of the disruption of changeing managers.

:lol:

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34 minutes ago, andyD said:

Can't help but feel you're not being honest there.

It's easy to rate them both that highly with hindsight, but looking where they were 18 months ago:

Fraser had spent a season as a bit part sub for Bournemouth in the Championship, was deemed not up to it when they got into the premier league so was loaned out to Ipswich in the Championship. He played ok for them but spent most of the season out injured. Even if you'd wanted to call him up then you probably couldn't because he wasn't fit to play.

Armstrong was a fairly regular Celtic player, not pulling up trees and stuck out on the left with not a great influence in most games.

If you'd said that 18 months ago you wanted to call up Johnny Russell and Tom Cairney I'd probably believe you, but Fraser and Armstrong? I think both of them would have been incredibly surprised and assumed it was a practical joke if they'd got call ups then.

I'd have had Armstrong in and around the squad before he even signed for Celtic :lol: 

So whether you feel i'm not being honest or not, isn't really relevant to me. 

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18 minutes ago, adamntg said:

That's not funny, I agree with him.

With you a degree, especially the advantage in having a long term manager. Strachan has made lot of mistakes even to the point were a lot of us wanted to lose to Slovenia just to get shot him. It could be better to let some one learn then continually chopping and changing.

Edited by ceudmilefailte
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1 hour ago, Parklife said:

I'd have had Armstrong in and around the squad before he even signed for Celtic :lol: 

So whether you feel i'm not being honest or not, isn't really relevant to me. 

backpedalled from "in the team" to "around the squad" already, eh? ;)

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55 minutes ago, andyD said:

backpedalled from "in the team" to "around the squad" already, eh? ;)

I think most would maybe agree that Armstrong should have been 'in the team' before he actually was.  When he was eventually picked, it was a no brainer.

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1 hour ago, BlueGaz said:

I think most would maybe agree that Armstrong should have been 'in the team' before he actually was.  When he was eventually picked, it was a no brainer.

Could have certainly been bought into the squad back when we was at Dundee Utd, as Strachan did with a few other players, that's no doubt true. Likewise Cairney might have got a call earlier as he's been a consistent performer (tho our midfield competition has dropped with the exits of people like Fletcher, Adam and Maloney). Ryan Fraser's a tough one.. He's always looked like he had potential to be good, but this is really his breakthrough season. Last season there were some good signs out on loan, but he was mostly on the treatment table. the season before was pretty bad, limited time on the pitch and little end product.  Season before he was more of a regular but again not much end product. Seems he's hit his groove now, and glad he was fit for this squad after pulling out of the last.

For me the key thing is that Strachan has his eyes open, is aware of these players and is putting them in the team. Anyone can say he should have done it sooner, and there's no doubt Strachan's a loyal guy when it comes to sticking by players, but he's now shown that if you do show you should be in there, then you will get a call.

A lot of the common complaints about Strachan have evaporated over the last two games, in my opinion.

> "He doesn't care." it's evident to see from his reactions not only to our goals but to the Kane equaliser that his heart is very much in this.
> "He's only picks his favourites." except across the last two squads we've had Armstrong, Cairney, Fraser, Murphy, Reynolds and McLean, with 3 debuts.
> "He's infelxible, he just plays 451." we started 343 against england and ended up 442.

2 good results in the last two games, 2 positive performances and while we need to keep this going we're back with a bit of hope of making it again. Pat on the back for Gordon at this point.

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  • 2 months later...

Revisiting this thread. In terms of probability, finishing 3rd is the most likely option.  Anyone changed their mind from two games ago? If so why.  Do we think our team will perform the same, worse of better with a different coach?

EURO 2020 stuff kicks off in another year, who in our squad is likely to retire or just not be up to the task in 12 months time?

Darren Fletcher, Scott Brown, Craig Gordon, Alan McGregor any more?  Do you think this will affect WGS's thinking if he has the option to stay on?  If we miss out, its likely going to be <3 points, realistically is this is a large enough gap that you would not offer him another extension or do you even think is progress?

 

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7 hours ago, kumnio said:

Strachan is still a smug useless bellend. Beating Lithuania who are Scottish Championship standard won't change my mind. 

The fans believing his nonsense don't have a clue imo. 

No matter the standard of opposition they played well on Friday. Have you seen our previous record in Lithuania ? Looks like there will be no pleasing folk like you.

Edited by Doric
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It's performances like Friday night which make me prepared to maybe give Strachan another campaign (real decider will be October).

if we can finish in 2nd place (regardless of play off situation) I think he will stay for the Nations League at least, but I would still not be shocked if he did walk (and with the last few results it would be with his head held high).

As for players, Brown and Fletcher will most certainly quit, but I think Gordon will give it another campaign (he is still fit enough and playing at a high enough level that it would be silly to step aside).... saying that, if Strachan stays I would not be surprised if he was able to talk players into giving the Nations League at least a shot (8 games across autum 2018 hardly asking to commit another 2/3 years).

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I think we should be using the Nations League as platform for building a team for the future. Decide who our best players are from the current crop, and start building a team around them. Trying out a few new players, but just a couple per game to try to retain some stability. Assess our weakest positions and try out some new options. It should be made clear to the fans that that is what they are doing, and whoever is manager for the Nations League should stay for the Euro 2020 qualifiers, no matter what happens. Whether that manager should be Strachan, or not, is a different question. IMO there is no point in using players in the Nations League who aren't going to be around for the EURO qualifiers.

The Nations League was designed as a replacement for meaningless friendlies. Let's use it as such, and build a team capable of qualifying automatically for EURO 2020. If we also get the extra back door route into the play offs, then that should be just treated as a bonus, which we hopefully won't not need to use. 

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2 minutes ago, Orraloon said:

I think we should be using the Nations League as platform for building a team for the future. Decide who our best players are from the current crop, and start building a team around them. Trying out a few new players, but just a couple per game to try to retain some stability. Assess our weakest positions and try out some new options. It should be made clear to the fans that that is what they are doing, and whoever is manager for the Nations League should stay for the Euro 2020 qualifiers, no matter what happens. Whether that manager should be Strachan, or not, is a different question. IMO there is no point in using players in the Nations League who aren't going to be around for the EURO qualifiers.

The Nations League was designed as a replacement for meaningless friendlies. Let's use it as such, and build a team capable of qualifying automatically for EURO 2020. If we also get the extra back door route into the play offs, then that should be just treated as a bonus, which we hopefully won't not need to use. 

Actually we should be using the Nations League with a view to qualify early through that (as we are playing teams roughly the same level as us) and takes the pressure right off for the Euro Qualifiers

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10 minutes ago, wanderer said:

Actually we should be using the Nations League with a view to qualify early through that (as we are playing teams roughly the same level as us) and takes the pressure right off for the Euro Qualifiers

We can't "qualify early" through the Nations League. That's not how it works. We can do enough to get into the playoffs but that is as far as it goes. 

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1 minute ago, Orraloon said:

We can't "qualify early" through the Nations League. That's not how it works. We can do enough to get into the playoffs but that is as far as it goes. 

Granted finals play off's will not be until March 2020, but knowing we have that fall back going into the qualifiers in 2019 would be a bonus and less pressure (Especially when top two teams qualify automatically)

 

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24 minutes ago, wanderer said:

Granted finals play off's will not be until March 2020, but knowing we have that fall back going into the qualifiers in 2019 would be a bonus and less pressure (Especially when top two teams qualify automatically)

 

II would be a bonus, but I would hope we wouldn't rely on it too much. 16 teams get into the playoffs and only 4 of them will qualify for EURO 2020. We would still need to beat two teams, of about our own standard, to qualify through that route.

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22 minutes ago, Orraloon said:

II would be a bonus, but I would hope we wouldn't rely on it too much. 16 teams get into the playoffs and only 4 of them will qualify for EURO 2020. We would still need to beat two teams, of about our own standard, to qualify through that route.

Easy, didn't you see the Lithuania game?

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Getting the best out of what he has? the draw against Lithuania at home didn't feel like that to me. Same goes for Slovakia away and arguably Slovenia at home where we scraped a win.

strachan really has some of you brain washed. 

for a manager getting the best out of what he has, look to Michale O'Neil, not Gordon Strachan. 

the pressure was arguably off against Lithuania because our chances of qualifying are slim. Nothing would please me more in football right now if Strachan got us to the playoffs but I don't think he will get us there. One good performance against a team we should be beating isn't going to change my mind.

 

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We played very well against a poor team on Friday. We also played reasonably well in the two games before that (Slovenia and England). However, we've also had abject performances vs Lithuania and Slovakia in this campaign. 

We're finally playing players who deserve to play and starting to get the balance of the side correct. McArthur playing middle of the park was important on Friday as he gets about the pitch and always gives our centre backs additional protection (which we badly lacked in Slovakia in particular). 

We've went from playing out of form players and looking disjointed and without clear direction, to playing players who are in form and who seem to have an understanding of how to play together and what the manager wants them to do. I'm hopeful that a corner has been turned, however, we're only 3 games removed from back-to-back 3-0 humpings.

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