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Scottish Cup Final - Hibs v Rangers


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3 hours ago, sbcmfc said:

As bits and pieces of footage emerge it does look like hibs fans assaulted Rangers players, which is bang out of order.

Very disappointing that after the wait to see their team win the cup, instead of running on to celebrate and making for their own players, they've made for the rangers players.

On the TV all I saw was a hibs fans appear to embrace kenny Miller.

I still don't know why the Rangers fans got involved mind you?

I still haven't seen any footage of Rangers players or officials being attacked . I didn't see it at th time either on the TV coverage . Were the hibs fans wrong to invade the pitch well yes  but after 114 years I can overlook it.  What the Rangers fans were doing on the park is beyond me. Looked to me like sour grapes , wanting to spoil the Hibs celebrations. But as usual Rangers will play the victim card, cos it's all about them. 

I ve no time for Rangers  but I was pleased Kenny Miller scored today. 

 

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6 hours ago, Debian said:

18 seconds. A bottle launched at the Rangers end.  Just joyful cracksters

Coming from the South Stand Upper by the looks of it....    

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Guest BlueGaz

Thanks to all the usual suspects for providing the after match entertainment.  Turned a shit day into a bit of a giggle in the end.  You can rely on the TAMB 'special' people to drag you out of the doldrums in times of need.  Couldn't make it up, great fun.

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6 hours ago, thewolf_1980 said:

Anyway...

I've had a cracking night out watching the English, Italian and German cup finals so ambivalence has set in but I will try and give my opinion on the day.

in answer to the balloon who questioned why I was somehow able to text whilst in concern over my safety, I'd say that I texted after I left the ground because that's where I felt safer. I didn't post from within. If I did you would have had a point. As it is, you don't. Our fans reacted, wrongly, to provocation. Hibs fans should have been more gracious in victory.

Secondly, and most importantly, congratulations to Hibs. You played ever so well. We were shite today and deserved to lose. I suspect we would have lost in extra time anyway because you wanted it more so losing in the last minute meant I got to the pub earlier! Stubbs got one over Warburton so, fair play.

If players and staff were assaulted then that's sad. I understand it did happen from a few folk I've spoken to (including some Hibs chums) but let's not blow it out of all proportion, as most media outlets are already doing.

Let's not blow it out of proportions?  Eh?  If, and it's a big if, rangers players and staff were assaulted, then the SFA have no choice but to throw the book at hibs.  It's as serious as the assault on neil Lennon.  If we get to the stage where football players are not safe on the pitch, then it will affect all football fans in Scotland.  We have stadiums that allow fans onto the pitch to avoid a hillsborough repetition - those stadiums can only operate if there is a certain level of trust that fans will not run onto the pitch and attack players.  Being caught up in a mob mentality and the excitement of winning the Scottish cup for the first time in over 100 years is not an excuse for assaulting football players (or anyone for that matter).

I would like to think everyone would agree that: 

1. Hibs fans invading the pitch is unacceptable and has not been seen in a cup final in decades, even for teams who hadn't won the cup before or in decades.  However, there is a certain level of understanding given hibs atrocious record in the Scottish cup, the circumstances of the win and the relief that must have been felt by their fans.

2. That understanding does not extend to hibs fans who made their way to the Rangers half of hampden for no other reason than to provoke rangers fans.  An odd way to celebrate.

3. Rangers fans who reacted to those hibs fans and any of the hibs fans who engaged in fighting on the pitch are clearly out of order. 

4. If there is found to be assaults on players and staff of Rangers (or hibs), the SFA must deal with that very strongly. 

This is the second time in a year fans have done this against rangers.  What actually happened to Motherwell?  There was also that incident where the Motherwell fan "accidentally" hit lee mcculloch in the face with his flag stick.  Did anything come of that?  Not likely is my guess but happy to be proved wrong. 

Lots of people on here have a go at Rangers for refusing to bury the hatchet regarding the past 5 years (and in some cases there is a valid point there), but as far as actual fans incidents go, it seems to me that it's other teams and not Rangers who have the pedigree for serious provocative behaviour. The SFA have to act where the SPL didn't with Motherwell to avoid this escalating.  

Call me paranoid but I think if Rangers fans had done something similar at the end of the semi final there would be a much less sympathetic response.  In fact the government would probably be convening a summit about it.

As far as the game goes, hibs were far more dangerous and effective than Rangers.  Possession wasn't used well and we looked rusty.  Of concern is that Stubbs appears to have tactically out thought Warburton.  The defence was an absolute shambles and there is definitely a lot of work required to rectify that.  

Well done to hibs - good to get that monkey off their back and I hope they get promoted next season cos Scottish football needs teams like hibs competing in the top league. 

Edited by bruce778
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12 hours ago, thplinth said:

These assaults would have been captured by multiple HD TV cameras from numerous different angles. Surprised we have not had footage on the major news channels by now.

 I have  heard STV have clear footage of a couple of attacks however they are not making it public. Possible police evidence. Also Sky's senior sports reporter made it clear last night they have footage but for legal reasons cant make it available.

"We have the pictures of what happened today, it really was like the bad old days, due to the fact these will have to be used as Police evidence and for various other reasons, we will not be showing them at any stage".

 

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Just seen a clip of what looks like Wallace being attacked. Seriously what goes through the heads of people like that? Your team have just achieved a holy grail and you feel the need to punch a player on the losing side. Words fail me.

The authorities would appear to have an awful lot to look at following yesterday from smoke bombs, sectarian chanting to the pitch invasion and all that ensued from that however well intentioned that may have been from the majority.

It might help if both clubs acknowledged that there was wrong doing on their side and that they will do everything to aide investigations to identify those responsible. 

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1 minute ago, AberdeenAngus said:

Just seen a clip of what looks like Wallace being attacked. Seriously what goes through the heads of people like that? Your team have just achieved a holy grail and you feel the need to punch a player on the losing side. Words fail me.

The authorities would appear to have an awful lot to look at following yesterday from smoke bombs, sectarian chanting to the pitch invasion and all that ensued from that however well intentioned that may have been from the majority.

It might help if both clubs acknowledged that there was wrong doing on their side and that they will do everything to aide investigations to identify those responsible. 

Rangers were wrong to put out their statement so soon however I think having your players and staff assaulted can maybe explain the heavy handedness of it.

Bruce has made an excellent post above except for the if around the assaults. It's now clear that they happened despite the usual suspects on here firmly ramming their heads up their jacksies. 

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1 hour ago, BlueGaz said:

Thanks to all the usual suspects for providing the after match entertainment.  Turned a shit day into a bit of a giggle in the end.  You can rely on the TAMB 'special' people to drag you out of the doldrums in times of need.  Couldn't make it up, great fun.

Couldn't make what up?

I think most people here seem to have the same opinion.

The pitch invasion was maybe silly but they happen regularly elsewhere. Still not condoned. 

Attacking players is completely out of line. 

Rangers fans weren't innocent like their club claim. Many of them came onto the pitch purely to fight and encouraged other to join. If Rangers fans had stayed in the stands would there have been any fighting among fans? Or would there just have been taunting?

 

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11 minutes ago, iainmac1 said:

Couldn't make what up?

I think most people here seem to have the same opinion.

The pitch invasion was maybe silly but they happen regularly elsewhere. Still not condoned. 

Attacking players is completely out of line. 

Rangers fans weren't innocent like their club claim. Many of them came onto the pitch purely to fight and encouraged other to join. If Rangers fans had stayed in the stands would there have been any fighting among fans? Or would there just have been taunting?

 

I don't think Rangers said their fans were innocent.  

Undeniably, Rangers fans went on the pitch, but it was in response to provocation and goading by hibs fans who went on the pitch and ran towards Rangers fans at the opposite end of the stadium - not just to celebrate their win like most pitch invasions.  

Fighting by by any supporter on the pitch is obviously unacceptable regardless of which team they support.  However, you're pretty naive if you expect that any set of fans at a neutral venue of 21.000 fans each would, on the whole, be so restrained so that none would respond to such goading or taunting - which hasn't been seen in Scottish football at such a game for decades.  

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Sevco fans had no need to be on the field, no need whatsoever. Invasions happening every year in England and it looks amazing. Now I've been part of one and can say they feel as good as they look 

Stewart Regan bumping his gums about Scottish football being tarred, nothing has tarred Scottish football more than him and his side kick Doncasters time in charge. Loathsome little kunnt 

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4 minutes ago, DoonTheSlope said:

Sevco fans had no need to be on the field, no need whatsoever. Invasions happening every year in England and it looks amazing. Now I've been part of one and can say they feel as good as they look 

Stewart Regan bumping his gums about Scottish football being tarred, nothing has tarred Scottish football more than him and his side kick Doncasters time in charge. Loathsome little kunnt 

Can see the spin machine at work.  This will be all Rangers fault in a few days time.

did hibs fans have a "need" to be on the pitch? 

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Great entertainment,  5 goals an injury time winner and a pitch invasion - this is what real football is all about.  I got through 60 minutes of the FA cup final dross and fell asleep, utter pish !!!

The Scottish FA & Police Scotland must seriously look at the conduct of that mob from Ibrox, in my living memory that's now 2 cup finals they have been involved in where there has been a pitch invasion and trouble on the pitch. You blue noses should hang your head in shame for your behaviour.

I hope the sun is shining for you Hibee's today !!!

 

 

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31 minutes ago, bruce778 said:

I don't think Rangers said their fans were innocent.  

Fighting by by any supporter on the pitch is obviously unacceptable regardless of which team they support.  However, you're pretty naive if you expect that any set of fans at a neutral venue of 21.000 fans each would, on the whole, be so restrained so that none would respond to such goading or taunting - which hasn't been seen in Scottish football at such a game for decades.  

Did they not say something about fan restraint?

On the 2nd point I'm not so sure. I do think rangers fans reacted worse than many other sets of fans would. They do have history.

If Falkirk had won last year and ran on to the pitch and come over to Caley fans to gloat there is no chance the same thing would have happened.

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Friend of mine is a Rangers supporter who was at the game with his 11 year old son and he says the behaviour of some of his fellow supporters at the end was "absolutely disgusting".  He was scared for his and his son's safety.  He was knocked to the ground by idiots trying to get into the pitch and also, unbelievably, the stairs were crushed by morons trying to get back in to go and fight.  He had to be pulled out and led to "relative safety".  

What goes through people's heads?  You lost, just go home. 

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1 hour ago, bruce778 said:

Let's not blow it out of proportions?  Eh?  If, and it's a big if, rangers players and staff were assaulted, then the SFA have no choice but to throw the book at hibs.  It's as serious as the assault on neil Lennon.  If we get to the stage where football players are not safe on the pitch, then it will affect all football fans in Scotland.  We have stadiums that allow fans onto the pitch to avoid a hillsborough repetition - those stadiums can only operate if there is a certain level of trust that fans will not run onto the pitch and attack players.  Being caught up in a mob mentality and the excitement of winning the Scottish cup for the first time in over 100 years is not an excuse for assaulting football players (or anyone for that matter).

I would like to think everyone would agree that: 

1. Hibs fans invading the pitch is unacceptable and has not been seen in a cup final in decades, even for teams who hadn't won the cup before or in decades.  However, there is a certain level of understanding given hibs atrocious record in the Scottish cup, the circumstances of the win and the relief that must have been felt by their fans.

2. That understanding does not extend to hibs fans who made their way to the Rangers half of hampden for no other reason than to provoke rangers fans.  An odd way to celebrate.

3. Rangers fans who reacted to those hibs fans and any of the hibs fans who engaged in fighting on the pitch are clearly out of order. 

4. If there is found to be assaults on players and staff of Rangers (or hibs), the SFA must deal with that very strongly. 

This is the second time in a year fans have done this against rangers.  What actually happened to Motherwell?  There was also that incident where the Motherwell fan "accidentally" hit lee mcculloch in the face with his flag stick.  Did anything come of that?  Not likely is my guess but happy to be proved wrong. 

Lots of people on here have a go at Rangers for refusing to bury the hatchet regarding the past 5 years (and in some cases there is a valid point there), but as far as actual fans incidents go, it seems to me that it's other teams and not Rangers who have the pedigree for serious provocative behaviour. The SFA have to act where the SPL didn't with Motherwell to avoid this escalating.  

Call me paranoid but I think if Rangers fans had done something similar at the end of the semi final there would be a much less sympathetic response.  In fact the government would probably be convening a summit about it.

As far as the game goes, hibs were far more dangerous and effective than Rangers.  Possession wasn't used well and we looked rusty.  Of concern is that Stubbs appears to have tactically out thought Warburton.  The defence was an absolute shambles and there is definitely a lot of work required to rectify that.  

Well done to hibs - good to get that monkey off their back and I hope they get promoted next season cos Scottish football needs teams like hibs competing in the top league. 

Great post. The voice of commonsense.

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37 minutes ago, bruce778 said:

I don't think Rangers said their fans were innocent.  

Undeniably, Rangers fans went on the pitch, but it was in response to provocation and goading by hibs fans who went on the pitch and ran towards Rangers fans at the opposite end of the stadium - not just to celebrate their win like most pitch invasions.  

Fighting by by any supporter on the pitch is obviously unacceptable regardless of which team they support.  However, you're pretty naive if you expect that any set of fans at a neutral venue of 21.000 fans each would, on the whole, be so restrained so that none would respond to such goading or taunting - which hasn't been seen in Scottish football at such a game for decades.  

At full time you can either stay and applaud or just go home.  It's only a game and if you want to fight over it, goaded or not, you're an idiot and shouldn't be allowed to attend. 

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2 minutes ago, adamntg said:

At full time you can either stay and applaud or just go home.  It's only a game and if you want to fight over it, goaded or not, you're an idiot and shouldn't be allowed to attend. 

I'm not disagreeing with that.  Unfortunately, its a reality that among football supporters of a crowd of that size there will be idiots.  You can't just not allow them to attend.  

Anyone fighting should be identified and dealt with by the law.  Clearly there were idiots on both sides but I highly doubt Rangers fans would have been fighting if not provoked in the first place, but who knows. 

Im sure many Rangers fans would like to have applauded their team after a long successful season despite defeat but were not allowed to because of the pitch invasion. 

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2 hours ago, bruce778 said:

Let's not blow it out of proportions?  Eh?  If, and it's a big if, rangers players and staff were assaulted, then the SFA have no choice but to throw the book at hibs.  It's as serious as the assault on neil Lennon.  If we get to the stage where football players are not safe on the pitch, then it will affect all football fans in Scotland.  We have stadiums that allow fans onto the pitch to avoid a hillsborough repetition - those stadiums can only operate if there is a certain level of trust that fans will not run onto the pitch and attack players.  Being caught up in a mob mentality and the excitement of winning the Scottish cup for the first time in over 100 years is not an excuse for assaulting football players (or anyone for that matter).

I would like to think everyone would agree that: 

1. Hibs fans invading the pitch is unacceptable and has not been seen in a cup final in decades, even for teams who hadn't won the cup before or in decades.  However, there is a certain level of understanding given hibs atrocious record in the Scottish cup, the circumstances of the win and the relief that must have been felt by their fans.

2. That understanding does not extend to hibs fans who made their way to the Rangers half of hampden for no other reason than to provoke rangers fans.  An odd way to celebrate.

3. Rangers fans who reacted to those hibs fans and any of the hibs fans who engaged in fighting on the pitch are clearly out of order. 

4. If there is found to be assaults on players and staff of Rangers (or hibs), the SFA must deal with that very strongly. 

This is the second time in a year fans have done this against rangers.  What actually happened to Motherwell?  There was also that incident where the Motherwell fan "accidentally" hit lee mcculloch in the face with his flag stick.  Did anything come of that?  Not likely is my guess but happy to be proved wrong. 

Lots of people on here have a go at Rangers for refusing to bury the hatchet regarding the past 5 years (and in some cases there is a valid point there), but as far as actual fans incidents go, it seems to me that it's other teams and not Rangers who have the pedigree for serious provocative behaviour. The SFA have to act where the SPL didn't with Motherwell to avoid this escalating.  

Call me paranoid but I think if Rangers fans had done something similar at the end of the semi final there would be a much less sympathetic response.  In fact the government would probably be convening a summit about it.

As far as the game goes, hibs were far more dangerous and effective than Rangers.  Possession wasn't used well and we looked rusty.  Of concern is that Stubbs appears to have tactically out thought Warburton.  The defence was an absolute shambles and there is definitely a lot of work required to rectify that.  

Well done to hibs - good to get that monkey off their back and I hope they get promoted next season cos Scottish football needs teams like hibs competing in the top league. 

Great post. Totally agree.

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26 minutes ago, DoonTheSlope said:

Sevco fans had no need to be on the field, no need whatsoever. Invasions happening every year in England and it looks amazing. Now I've been part of one and can say they feel as good as they look 

Stewart Regan bumping his gums about Scottish football being tarred, nothing has tarred Scottish football more than him and his side kick Doncasters time in charge. Loathsome little kunnt 

We'll said sir

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13 minutes ago, bruce778 said:

I'm not disagreeing with that.  Unfortunately, its a reality that among football supporters of a crowd of that size there will be idiots.  You can't just not allow them to attend.  

Anyone fighting should be identified and dealt with by the law.  Clearly there were idiots on both sides but I highly doubt Rangers fans would have been fighting if not provoked in the first place, but who knows. 

Im sure many Rangers fans would like to have applauded their team after a long successful season despite defeat but were not allowed to because of the pitch invasion. 

I agree.  I think Rangers as a club would've been better served by keeping their powder dry in the immediate aftermath instead of playing the victim card straight away. 

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