Flat Earth Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 Apologies if I've missed it, had a quick skim but didn't see any thread about this. So aye, anyway, Craigie Broon tried to implement some radical new rule back in the late 90s that played a big part in France winning the world cup in 98. Turns out that after failing to even qualify in 94 and 98 Gerrard Houllier came up with an idea that the French clubs should be limited in the size of their squads - no more than 20 players over the age of 21. As a result of this teams like Marseille had to play 17 year olds Henry and Trezeguet as injury cover. And this, Broon asserts, played a huge part in France winning the World Cup in 98 with a young squad. So Broony saw this, saw it was a good idea, tried to bring it in here - but it was veto'd by two clubs, who claimed it would affect their European chances. In reality it would have stopped them accumulating 40+ squads and cherry picking the top players of Motherwell, Killie, Hibs, St Johnstone, Dundee etc, most of which in that era played a handful of games, got splinters in their erses, and were shunted off to lower division English sides once the league was won. So, how did all that work out in the end? With the benefit of hindsight... Did the fortunes of the international side improve? Did the OF set Europe on fire? (Metaphorically rather than literally). And did our domestic game grow in health and vibrancy? (Rhetorical). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bino's Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 it was Monaco but why didn't all the non old firm clubs implement it why don't they tomorrow they're all just as stupid as the old firm and can't see playing journeymen Irishmen ahead of their youths has made them worse Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flat Earth Posted September 15, 2016 Author Share Posted September 15, 2016 8 minutes ago, Bino's said: it was Monaco but why didn't all the non old firm clubs implement it You need to look up "veto". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bino's Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 any club chairman could freely implement at his own club tomorrow like Hamilton did and got better like hibs did for a time and produced brown, Thomson, o'connor, Riordan and Fletcher and sold them on Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macy37 Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 I don't understand how the fact the two teams saying no meant it didn't happen? Curry powder applied to the story? Surely 2 no's versus 8 yes would carry? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ErsatzThistle Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 (edited) 15 minutes ago, Bino's said: any club chairman could freely implement at his own club tomorrow like Hamilton did and got better like hibs did for a time and produced brown, Thomson, o'connor, Riordan and Fletcher and sold them on Just a shame that O'Connor and Riordan were a pair of brainless neds (and proud of it) who threw away what could have been amazing careers. Wish that one day UEFA or FIFA will step in and put an end to the Old Firm dictatorship's control over our league's money, structure and rules. Edited September 15, 2016 by ErsatzThistle Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flat Earth Posted September 15, 2016 Author Share Posted September 15, 2016 12 minutes ago, Bino's said: any club chairman could freely implement at his own club tomorrow Why would any one club deliberately disadvantage themselves? It has to be all clubs or nothing for something like this. Voluntary is like booting yourself in the balls to make a vain point. Having said that I would guess that many clubs actually complied with this rule as a side effect of being utterly skint and trying to make limited resources stretch as far as possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fringo Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 54 minutes ago, Flat Earth said: Apologies if I've missed it, had a quick skim but didn't see any thread about this. So aye, anyway, Craigie Broon tried to implement some radical new rule back in the late 90s that played a big part in France winning the world cup in 98. Turns out that after failing to even qualify in 94 and 98 Gerrard Houllier came up with an idea that the French clubs should be limited in the size of their squads - no more than 20 players over the age of 21. As a result of this teams like Marseille had to play 17 year olds Henry and Trezeguet as injury cover. And this, Broon asserts, played a huge part in France winning the World Cup in 98 with a young squad. So Broony saw this, saw it was a good idea, tried to bring it in here - but it was veto'd by two clubs, who claimed it would affect their European chances. In reality it would have stopped them accumulating 40+ squads and cherry picking the top players of Motherwell, Killie, Hibs, St Johnstone, Dundee etc, most of which in that era played a handful of games, got splinters in their erses, and were shunted off to lower division English sides once the league was won. So, how did all that work out in the end? With the benefit of hindsight... Did the fortunes of the international side improve? Did the OF set Europe on fire? (Metaphorically rather than literally). And did our domestic game grow in health and vibrancy? (Rhetorical). Welcome back FE ! A good, old fashioned rant which I 100% agree with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fringo Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 Oh, and the point from J Collins about the Hibs players going to the chairman to complain about his training. Sadly sums up the Scottish game and the attitude of lazy players. We're f*cked. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
giblet Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 28 minutes ago, Flat Earth said: You need to look up "veto". unfortunately Aberdeen stepped up to the plate and joined Celtic to veto plans to improve the Scottish game when Rangers were absent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flat Earth Posted September 15, 2016 Author Share Posted September 15, 2016 4 minutes ago, giblet said: unfortunately Aberdeen stepped up to the plate and joined Celtic to veto plans to improve the Scottish game when Rangers were absent. Protecting self interests is no way to manage a league. The governing body of the SPFL needs to be independent of the clubs - they've proven they are unfit to be involved in the decision making. But the OF are the worst for it... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
giblet Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 I think you are seeing a number of Countries where a couple of teams are getting so far ahead in terms of finance that you are going to see integrated leagues within next 10 years. Despite them not getting the finance of the English clubs, Celtic and Rangers (when they eventually get themselves sorted) are just simply too big against the rest of the clubs. Could easily see a Northern Atlantic Region league develop/Scandanavian/North Europe/South Europe/West/East. Might be the only chance we have before we head to the realms of the Irish league. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bino's Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 21 minutes ago, Flat Earth said: Why would any one club deliberately disadvantage themselves? It has to be all clubs or nothing for something like this. Voluntary is like booting yourself in the balls to make a vain point. Having said that I would guess that many clubs actually complied with this rule as a side effect of being utterly skint and trying to make limited resources stretch as far as possible. Hamilton and hibs did it and got better the rest have never tried Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacques Hunt Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 15 minutes ago, fringo said: Oh, and the point from J Collins about the Hibs players going to the chairman to complain about his training. Sadly sums up the Scottish game and the attitude of lazy players. We're f*cked. I think Paul le Guen got a similar reception from Rangers players. Ram yer healthy diet and Nae bevvy pish, we're Scottish, we dinnae need tae train hard. Geez a pie and a bottle ay Irn Bru. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bino's Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 the answers are all very obvious play youth, get fit, play the ball on the deck we refuse to do any of them Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoonTheSlope Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 (edited) 35 minutes ago, ErsatzThistle said: Just a shame that O'Connor and Riordan were a pair of brainless neds (and proud of it) who threw away what could have been amazing careers. Wish that one day UEFA or FIFA will step in and put an end to the Old Firm dictatorship's control over our league's money, structure and rules. The dictatorship could have collapsed in 2012(?) when the real Rangers went bust and the voting rights were being discussed. Aberdeen fcuked it for the rest of us, and now it's a case of as you were Edited September 15, 2016 by DoonTheSlope Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fringo Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 (edited) 50 minutes ago, ErsatzThistle said: Just a shame that O'Connor and Riordan were a pair of brainless neds (and proud of it) who threw away what could have been amazing careers. Wish that one day UEFA or FIFA will step in and put an end to the Old Firm dictatorship's control over our league's money, structure and rules. That will never happen as they actually feeding all of this in many countries and live well off it . Take the Champions League as an example. Edited September 15, 2016 by fringo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bino's Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 the individual clubs can do it themselves no need to blame the old firm if they did in a couple of seasons they would be competing with the old firm and profiting off selling them their best players, to be replaced by the next youths like they used to do Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adamntg Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 (edited) I've always thought that a maximum squad size was one of the most important things you could do to make the league more competitive and more interesting. If Celtic want to take GMS from Dundee Utd and think he'll improve their team then so be it - whose place does he take in the squad? If they take him and leave him to rot while the opposition goes down the pan - what's the point in that? Edited September 15, 2016 by adamntg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fringo Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 1 minute ago, adamntg said: I've always thought that a maximum squad size was one of the most important things you could do to make the league more competitive and more interesting. If Celtic want to take GMS from Dundee Utd and think he'll improve their team then so be it. If they take him and leave him to rot whole the opposition goes down the pan - what's the point in that? Which is exactly what the OF have been doing for many years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grim Jim Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 1 hour ago, giblet said: unfortunately Aberdeen stepped up to the plate and joined Celtic to veto plans to improve the Scottish game when Rangers were absent. 1 hour ago, DoonTheSlope said: The dictatorship could have collapsed in 2012(?) when the real Rangers went bust and the voting rights were being discussed. Aberdeen fcuked it for the rest of us, and now it's a case of as you were Aye, and I've been wondering what the photies contained ever since. What am I missing? I don't disagree with FE/Broonys' point though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macy37 Posted September 16, 2016 Share Posted September 16, 2016 Can anyone answer why Broons idea didn't go through? If only 2 clubs said no why did the rest not carry? Did the OF have more votes? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PASTA Mick Posted September 16, 2016 Share Posted September 16, 2016 Whilst the idea me might be good, a smaller squad at Celtic wouldn't have meant Mark Burchill would have become Thierry Henry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barney Rubble Posted September 16, 2016 Share Posted September 16, 2016 1 hour ago, macy37 said: Can anyone answer why Broons idea didn't go through? If only 2 clubs said no why did the rest not carry? Did the OF have more votes? IIRC any proposal required a minimum of 11-1 to be passed. The routemap to preserving the cosy cartel was - innovative proposal gets tabled, the ugly sisters cuddle up to each other for the vote, and hey presto, innovative proposal is consigned to the bin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macy37 Posted September 16, 2016 Share Posted September 16, 2016 55 minutes ago, Barney Rubble said: IIRC any proposal required a minimum of 11-1 to be passed. The routemap to preserving the cosy cartel was - innovative proposal gets tabled, the ugly sisters cuddle up to each other for the vote, and hey presto, innovative proposal is consigned to the bin. What a ridiculous set up! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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