Maq Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 I think oor Nicola has played a blinder here Basically saying that in the event of an in/out referendum on the EU, an 'out' win wouldn't be sufficient to take the UK out of the EU - each individual member state (Scotland, England, Wales, Norn Iron) would each have to vote for it as well. So if England, Wales and Norn Iron all voted 80% each to leave, and Scotland voted 51% to stay in - the UK would have to stay in the EU. If the UK is to be an 'equal family of members' as we were told during our referendum, then that's the way it's got to be. As an added bonus, it will properly rile up Farage and his ilk! Only downside, from the view of someone who wants Scotland to be independent, is that if the rUK votes to leave the EU, but Scotland wanted to remain, it would give our Independence movement a real surge. But I suppose if there is a divide on opinion amongst the countries/regions, that will also lead to discussion about how to change things I think she's played this one well Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auld_Reekie Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 Absolutely. There's no way Tories or UKIP will agree to it, possibly even Labour, as it hands Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland power and they will not endorse that. Which means that when it's slapped down, Nicola can highlight the fractures in the UK again and will be able to then position another independence referendum in future. There's another reason it will not be allowed. It means in order to reject EU withdrawal, the pro-EU campaign just needs to focus on one constituent nation to stop it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sbcmfc Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 Seen that Coburn guy on tv a few times and read some of his comments. What an obnoxious bell end he is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maq Posted October 29, 2014 Author Share Posted October 29, 2014 Seen that Coburn guy on tv a few times and read some of his comments. What an obnoxious bell end he is. Aye! Still canna believe he was voted in as an MEP for Scotland. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maq Posted October 29, 2014 Author Share Posted October 29, 2014 Just seen Wings have covered this as well now Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UPROAR Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 forcing the Unionist parties to say whether they think Scotland is a country or not.... nice Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maq Posted October 29, 2014 Author Share Posted October 29, 2014 And the New Statesman from a few days ago: "Should a majority in Scotland vote to remain in the EU while the rest of the UK opts to secede, another referendum on independence would be the consequence, with the probable end of the British state." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scunnered Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 She's done well there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auld_Reekie Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 Rejected already by Cameron. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maq Posted October 29, 2014 Author Share Posted October 29, 2014 Rejected already by Cameron. Good! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kumnio Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 Seen that Coburn guy on tv a few times and read some of his comments. What an obnoxious bell end he is. Mr Coburn of UKIP told Good Morning Scotland: "Our country is Great Britain. I don't hold a Scottish passport I hold a British passport. No it isnt you fat useless waste of DNA, GB is an island, UK is a country, FFS, its bad enough when a normal person doesnt get this, let alone an elected official. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flora MaDonald Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 We gave away all our rights to anything when we voted No. Our masters shall decide for us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maq Posted October 29, 2014 Author Share Posted October 29, 2014 We gave away all our rights to anything when we voted No. Our masters shall decide for us. Hopefully some of the 55 will start realising this - though I do wonder how many of them will care Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alibi Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 There is another reason why the EU referendum is a problem for unionists. NI has an agreement (part of the Good Friday agreement I think) which means that in the event of a UK withdrawal from the EU, they would get a referendum to decide whether to stay in the UK or to re-unite with the rest of Ireland. In other words, NI has an inbuilt right to leave the UK. i was quite surprised to discover that (via Mike Russell in a debate during the referendum campaign). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thorbotnic Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 There is another reason why the EU referendum is a problem for unionists. NI has an agreement (part of the Good Friday agreement I think) which means that in the event of a UK withdrawal from the EU, they would get a referendum to decide whether to stay in the UK or to re-unite with the rest of Ireland. In other words, NI has an inbuilt right to leave the UK. i was quite surprised to discover that (via Mike Russell in a debate during the referendum campaign). This is not mentioned in the GFA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thorbotnic Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 I think oor Nicola has played a blinder here Basically saying that in the event of an in/out referendum on the EU, an 'out' win wouldn't be sufficient to take the UK out of the EU - each individual member state (Scotland, England, Wales, Norn Iron) would each have to vote for it as well. So if England, Wales and Norn Iron all voted 80% each to leave, and Scotland voted 51% to stay in - the UK would have to stay in the EU. If the UK is to be an 'equal family of members' as we were told during our referendum, then that's the way it's got to be. As an added bonus, it will properly rile up Farage and his ilk! Only downside, from the view of someone who wants Scotland to be independent, is that if the rUK votes to leave the EU, but Scotland wanted to remain, it would give our Independence movement a real surge. But I suppose if there is a divide on opinion amongst the countries/regions, that will also lead to discussion about how to change things I think she's played this one well I think that if any of the other member countries were to 'go against the grain' and vote differently from the rest, then this argument might stack up - after all, none of us have been asked whether we want to remain part of the UK or not. However, Scotland has explicitly stated that is does. As a country, you actively decided that you wanted to be part of the UK - that means accepting the whole of the UK as a sovereign state. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larky Masher Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 I think that if any of the other member countries were to 'go against the grain' and vote differently from the rest, then this argument might stack up - after all, none of us have been asked whether we want to remain part of the UK or not. However, Scotland has explicitly stated that is does. As a country, you actively decided that you wanted to be part of the UK - that means accepting the whole of the UK as a sovereign state. Don't bring logic into it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EvilScotsman Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 I think that if any of the other member countries were to 'go against the grain' and vote differently from the rest, then this argument might stack up - after all, none of us have been asked whether we want to remain part of the UK or not. However, Scotland has explicitly stated that is does. As a country, you actively decided that you wanted to be part of the UK - that means accepting the whole of the UK as a sovereign state. The Scottish, Welsh and Northern Irish have political parties dedicated to removing their nations from the UK - if and when they form a majority in Wales or N.I.'s assemblies, they may well hold a referendum on the subject. Until there's an English equivalent, this won't happen south of the border. It's hardly the fault of the Scots. You also can't ignore the scare stories regarding the EU which were regurgitated time and time again prior to the referendum. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EvilScotsman Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 Don't bring logic into it. It's hardly your specialist subject, is it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UPROAR Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 note that the EU law and Convention on Human rights are built into the Devolution agreements. This means even if the UK were to withdraw all 3 devolved nations would have to comply with ongoing EU laws and conventions. Given that the 'vow' promised to entrench the current devo settlement in law I just can't see how this will end well... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larky Masher Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 The Scottish, Welsh and Northern Irish have political parties dedicated to removing their nations from the UK - if and when they form a majority in Wales or N.I.'s assemblies, they may well hold a referendum on the subject. Until there's an English equivalent, this won't happen south of the border. It's hardly the fault of the Scots. You also can't ignore the scare stories regarding the EU which were regurgitated time and time again prior to the referendum. It's the fault of the 55% of the electorate who voted no, however this is an issue that the SNP failed to use to any great effect in the referendum campaign. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clyde1998 Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 Coburn MEP (UKIP) - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-29816342 How did he get elected!? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flora MaDonald Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 Pin-up boy of the Union Bears. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flure Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 Coburn MEP (UKIP) - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-29816342 How did he get elected!? I did not know that he was "openly gay". David Coburn, Scotland The last of the Ukip MEPs to be announced, Mr Coburn is the party's first ever in Scotland and said the “revolution” had spread north of the Border. Yet he has also claimed that gay marriage “breeds homophobia” and that he would move to ban it - despite being openly gay and in a 30-year-strong relationship with the same partner. Mr Coburn told The Scotsman: “Civil partnerships should be enough. Gay marriage breeds homophobia as people are happy enough to tolerate gay people. I don’t see the point of crossing the road to pick a fight with people of faith.” http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/ukips-meps-after-months-of-gaffes-and-controversies-meet-the-people-who-will-represent-britain-in-the-european-parliament-9435149.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saintlyscot Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 Holding westminster's feet to the fire.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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