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James Mclean Letter Re: The Poppy


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First of all absolutely no-one should be forced to wear a poppy.

"Mr Whelan, for me to wear a poppy would be as much a gesture of disrespect for the innocent people who lost their lives in the Troubles –"
is he speaking for the 644 civilians killed by the IRA? and the 272 RUC men and women? Leaving aside the 656 British soldiers?

For once I agree entirely with Eddard.

No idea why this is in 'football related' either. This daftie's childish political views are f*ck all to do with football.

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I think Dave the Bankie called it well. I wear a poppy for a couple of days up to and including Remembrance Sunday, and I plan to head to Haymarket tomorrow. The US style fetishisation of the armed forces is worrying. McLean is entitled to his beliefs too.

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He's given the same explanation in each of the last four years so it can't be classified as "news", why he needs to tell everyone again is beyond me. Attention seeking!

I was thinking the same thing i remember he made a big fuss about choosing to play for the Republic of Ireland compared to NI rubbed a lot of folk up the wrong way.

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It's not news.

It's only on here because Hoopy picked it up on a Celtic forum, and ran here with it trying to get a reaction.

I've got no idea as well why this non-entity (McLean, not Hoopy) has to tell the world his opinion on poppy day.

Worked a treat.

He's pulling in the large landing net as I type.

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At the end of the day it is up to one's personal view and you should be able to make your own choice on wearing a poppy or not. No surprises I don't wear one. I do respect those who fought in WW1 and WW2 but I will not pay towards supporting wars that have come after through greed of politicians. One other gripe I have is that those poor men who fought for years at the front and who were effected so badly that they could not fight anymore were branded as cowards,strapped to a post and shot.As far as I am aware none of these mens names are on any monument.Maybe its time to introduce white poppies.

Rossy there were no so called terrorists killed in Bloody Sunday,they were all civilians taking part in a peace march.Oh and I take no sides in the Irish troubles.

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At the end of the day it is up to one's personal view and you should be able to make your own choice on wearing a poppy or not. No surprises I don't wear one. I do respect those who fought in WW1 and WW2 but I will not pay towards supporting wars that have come after through greed of politicians. One other gripe I have is that those poor men who fought for years at the front and who were effected so badly that they could not fight anymore were branded as cowards,strapped to a post and shot.As far as I am aware none of these mens names are on any monument.Maybe its time to introduce white poppies.

Rossy there were no so called terrorists killed in Bloody Sunday,they were all civilians taking part in a peace march.Oh and I take no sides in the Irish troubles.

I can't agree with this at all. By wearing a poppy you are not supporting wars or the greed of politicians. It's a symbol to honour those who have been wounded or killed defending our country and helping others.

I don't agree with the wars in Iraq, Afghanistan or a lot of the NI conflict but that doesn't mean I don't wear a poppy.

What about the Falklands? Should we just forget about that? The Balkans? Or British troops killed while rescuing hostages in Africa?

People just don't get it. These guys were doing their job, following orders. They don't go through choice.

I'm not suggesting everyone should wear a poppy, it's a choice but I think it's more dishonourable to refuse to support it based on the actions of politicians rather than the actions of soldiers.

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For once I agree entirely with Eddard.

No idea why this is in 'football related' either. This daftie's childish political views are f*ck all to do with football.

so because you don't agree with him he is daft and childish?? The reason he made the statement is that last year he got dogs abuse for refusing to wear the poppy shirt while playing for Sunderland so felt the need to explain his reasons this time. I fully support his refusing to wear the poppy, and I say that as someone who lost a mate to the IRA

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so because you don't agree with him he is daft and childish?? The reason he made the statement is that last year he got dogs abuse for refusing to wear the poppy shirt while playing for Sunderland so felt the need to explain his reasons this time. I fully support his refusing to wear the poppy, and I say that as someone who lost a mate to the IRA

i support his right not to wear a poppy.

But just as people (including me), criticise the politicising of the poppy these days, then I reserve the right to criticise people who find a political reason not to wear one.

It's a symbol of remembrance for f*cks sake, it's not giving support to anyone involved in the Troubles 40 odd years ago.

McLean needs to grow up. Everyone knows his political views...I don't see why he 'deserves respect' for coming out with this rubbish.

Edited by Rossy
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McLean's letter aside, when did this poppy mentalness really start?

I mind having to wear a poppy at primary school due to an overzealous military wife teacher in the 80s without any understanding of what it meant, but beyond that I've never worn one.

It's a post Iraq thing as far as I can mind.

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McLean's letter aside, when did this poppy mentalness really start?

I mind having to wear a poppy at primary school due to an overzealous military wife teacher in the 80s without any understanding of what it meant, but beyond that I've never worn one.

It's a post Iraq thing as far as I can mind.

I remember that in my primary school it was more a case of half the kids getting one because everyone else had one !

Round about 2007 or 2008 was when Gordon Brown and the tabloid press launched the whole "respect our heroic forces" agenda and all these events kicked off. Personally whilst I do have a great respect for the people in armed forces, I think it is gone way over the top now.

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It should all be down to personal choice. It's interesting to Sergio Aguero on Football Focus wearing one. I do have to wonder what the likelihood is of an Argentine citizen wearing a Poppy voluntarily. Everyone on the BBC (and other tv channels) seems to be wearing one - I suspect they're automatically festooned in them.

And, yes, I do wear a poppy but I totally understand why some people do not.

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Round about 2007 or 2008 was when Gordon Brown and the tabloid press launched the whole "respect our heroic forces" agenda and all these events kicked off.

Did you see the BBC documentary called 'The lion's last roar?'? Cracking documentary, link here: http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b04ndzn8

Anyway, in it it shows part of a press conference with the head of the army at the time (General Danatt) saying how much he admired the way soldiers are revered in America, and wishing the same happened in the UK.

The armed forces (or the head honchos at least) are just as responsible as the politicians for pushing this agenda.

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It should all be down to personal choice. It's interesting to Sergio Aguero on Football Focus wearing one. I do have to wonder what the likelihood is of an Argentine citizen wearing a Poppy voluntarily. Everyone on the BBC (and other tv channels) seems to be wearing one - I suspect they're automatically festooned in them.

And, yes, I do wear a poppy but I totally understand why some people do not.

I think folk on tv have always all had one on. I remember questioning this when I was quite young (and why the folk on Tv had leaves on theirs (turns out it's because must tv comes from England))

I don't imagine they all turn up at the studios already wearing ones they bought in the street mind you...

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Worked a treat.

He's pulling in the large landing net as I type.

Wonder who is providing the most content to this not a news (apart from blanket coverage in the news) issue.

Member name

Posts Rossy 5

We could also go back into the archives and have a wee look at the previous incarnations of this thread 9we get each year) :-)) :-))

Edited by phart
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Did you see the BBC documentary called 'The lion's last roar?'? Cracking documentary, link here: http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b04ndzn8

Anyway, in it it shows part of a press conference with the head of the army at the time (General Danatt) saying how much he admired the way soldiers are revered in America, and wishing the same happened in the UK.

The armed forces (or the head honchos at least) are just as responsible as the politicians for pushing this agenda.

I'll definitely give that a watch :ok:

I find the way the that some American's venerate their military and decorate everything in stars and stripes bunting to be really cringeworthy and jingoistic.

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what a saddo

Really, I know plenty of hearts fans who are embarrassed by the way the McCraes battalion is now being seized upon by hearts to make them a "special" club.

What about the suggestion they are benefiting financially from this?

Edited by dan cake
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Firstly, on McLean himself - Unless I'm mistaken, he's not seeking publicity over this. It wasn't a press release, it was a letter to his club chairman which was subsequently published by the club and picked up by the media. Also, and I may be being over generous here, the reason he gives for not wearing a poppy may not be why he's actually made the decision. He may simply be trying to avoid getting grief/abuse whenever he goes home.

Secondly...

I find the way the that some American's venerate their military and decorate everything in stars and stripes bunting to be really cringeworthy and jingoistic.

And it's definitely become more and more the case over here in recent years as well. This is one of the reasons I've actually stopped wearing a poppy in recent years. In addition, I feel the right-wing tabloids have hijacked what should be an event of remembrance to fuel support for the recent activities of the British military in Iraq and Afghanistan.

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It should be up to the individual whether they wear the poppy or not. After all, those commemorated fought and died for such freedoms did they not ? Condemnation of those who choose not to is surely reactionary and authoritarian.

Further, DTB is correct to highlight the "Americanisation" of UK military, in this light.

Scottish Labour MP, Thomas Docherty (Dunfermline & West Fife) has a private bill which has reached 2nd reading at Westminster based on anti-discrimination of UK military. www.thomasdocherty.org.uk He has received direct support from MoD to assist his bill.

They have, together, revealed "shocking" statistics.

So what ? Under this law military, whilst wearing uniform, are to receive improved public services. Failure for e.g. a restaurant to do so may result in legal action taken against them. Additionally, employers may be prosecuted for failure to hire army reservists or hold their jobs open if those reservists volunteer for operational service (normally approx. 12 months incl pre-deployment training and post-operational tour leave).

This is a significant enforcement piece of legislation which requires civil society to enhance military service - whether they want to or not.

It is no real surprise that the Labour party are as keen to introduce such legislation to be supported and approved by the Conservative government. Some may see such pro-militarist alliance as merely a continuation of Better Together.

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