Leaked Blood Tests Reveal Massive Doping Suspicions In Distance Running

[phart]

2 hours ago, Caledonian Craig said:

Exactly. This Russian hacking into stuff is obviously not well-informed in what is PED's as these are legal and prescribed stuff.

It's nothing to do with "informed" it's copies of athletes TUE's. Everyone knows that is a legal process. You're arguing stuff that should be axiomatic.

What should be noticed is why are folk getting backdated TUE's for PED's before major tours. Lance Armstrong also got a backdated cortisol TUE in 1999.

Anyway it's funny to me how Froome has essentially been up front, while Wiggins has a whole smorgasbord of asthma and steroid TUE's issued before tours.

Bet the press focus on Froome as well.

[phart]

Serena Williams having a TUE for an opiate is interesting as well.

a cocktail of pain pills and all sorts of shit.

[phart]

Wiggins has had 3 TUEs for triamcinolone acetonide, one just before the 2011 Tour, one before the 2012 Tour, and one before the 2013 Giro.

Ostensibly for hayfever , intramuscular steroid injections for hayfever right before 3 grand tours and never when training the rest of the year.

All perfect by the letter of the law if not the spirit.

[phart]

Also kenacort (the trade name) is one of the main drugs that willy Voet was a mule for when the 1998 Festina doping scandal almost shut down the Tour.

All those asthma inhalers you'd think Wiggins would stop smoking to alleviate his symptoms.

[phart]

Christophe bassons on cortisole

[Huddersfield]

8 hours ago, phart said:

corticosteroids must be a placebo then , cause doping cyclists use it for performance enhancing all the time. You're just stating what they're meant to be used in treatment of, not what their actual affect on performance is.

anabolic just means muscle building, not really what is needed for a cyclist. Corticosteroids are powerful drugs which can quickly reduce swelling and inflammation, greatly improve symptoms and provoke incredible results.

From the Lance Armstrong debacle.

Corticosteroids (e.g., cortisone). These drugs reduce inflammation, assist in recovery and can provide a burst of energy and create a temporary feeling of increased energy and well-being. Throughout the relevant time period, corticosteroids were improperly provided to cyclists by team doctors and trainers to increase energy and enhance performance. … USADA will also rely upon firsthand testimony from witnesses who were aware of Armstrong’s use of cortisone without medical authorization.

 

I must also admit that Froome's TUE use is a lot less and entirely in line with what he has stated. Turns out he was totally transparent about his use of TUE's.

I wonder if Armstrong's experience is of injecting very high quantities (not clinically advisable for any illness I know of), which I know has happened, rather than a reference to prescribed prednisolone? I've taken those tablets (horrible little things; 8 in one go) & you really don't get any sort of sudden rush. There is a general adrenalin increase while on them (you have to wean yourself off them, after even a few days use), but in my experience anyway it's a steady build up to return breathing to normal over a few days.

[phart]

2 hours ago, Huddersfield said:

I wonder if Armstrong's experience is of injecting very high quantities (not clinically advisable for any illness I know of), which I know has happened, rather than a reference to prescribed prednisolone? I've taken those tablets (horrible little things; 8 in one go) & you really don't get any sort of sudden rush. There is a general adrenalin increase while on them (you have to wean yourself off them, after even a few days use), but in my experience anyway it's a steady build up to return breathing to normal over a few days.

that's oral administration this was injections.

everything is 100% legal, however they coincide with his massive weightloss and the prescribed drugs can also be used for weight loss as well as treating the ailments on the TUE. Corticosteroids work by also shifting energy production in the body from glucose to fats and amino acids (the weight loss factor)

http://d3epuodzu3wuis.cloudfront.net/BOWERS+Witness+Statement.pdf 

last paragraph of page one. Chief science officer for USADA giving witness testimony about cortisole abuse in the peleton.

It's just funny cause SKY said they didn't believe in in competition TUE's etc, while they were clearly using them.

 

[biffer]

Also funny that all of Wiggo's TUEs are after he switched to road from velodrome. 

[phart]

"Commenting on the Team Sky TUE controversy, former professional Joerg Jaksche has said that injections of Triamcinolone acetonide were a standard grey area doping practice used by professional riders in the past.

The German rider was involved in the Operacion Puerto controversy and later admitted to blood doping during his career. He became a whistleblower about illegal practices in the sport. He told CyclingTips that he and others would acquire Therepeutic Use Exemptions (TUEs) to get a green light to use otherwise banned injections of cortisone for races such as the Tour de France."

" Triamcinolone acetonide is a corticosteroid which was involved in Lance Armstrong’s positive test during the 1999 Tour de France. The Texan had taken the substance prior to the race and, after traces were detected in his system, he acquired a backdated TUE. This controversially allowed him to continue in the Tour, and to win the first of seven consecutive titles. "

http://cyclingtips.com/2016/09/jaksche-on-skys-tue-controversy-we-used-the-same-excuse-in-my-era/

@Huddersfield I would check the papers today several people are talking on how powerful a drug Wiggins was using, David Millar, David Walsh etc.

This is all legal though.

Edited September 18, 2016 by phart

[Huddersfield]

21 minutes ago, phart said:

@Huddersfield I would check the papers today several people are talking on how powerful a drug Wiggins was using, David Millar, David Walsh etc.

This is all legal though.

I've not had much chance to keep up with this to be honest, so are they saying that Wiggins was injecting huge doses of prednisolone, or are they just misunderstanding & over-stating what a routine (oral) dose of it is & does? It is a very powerful drug even at prescribed doses, people with lung issues generally dread going on it, but performance-enhancing it ain't.

I think what puzzles me is that, based on the fact we are told this was legitimate and prescribed, that any doctor would prescribe a dangerously high dose of it. The highest dose I've ever been given for life-threatening breathing difficulty is 7 days @ 40mg followed by a week's withdrawal.

 

[phart]

8 minutes ago, Huddersfield said:

I've not had much chance to keep up with this to be honest, so are they saying that Wiggins was injecting huge doses of prednisolone, or are they just misunderstanding & over-stating what a routine (oral) dose of it is & does? It is a very powerful drug even at prescribed doses, people with lung issues generally dread going on it, but performance-enhancing it ain't.

I think what puzzles me is that, based on the fact we are told this was legitimate and prescribed, that any doctor would prescribe a dangerously high dose of it. The highest dose I've ever been given for life-threatening breathing difficulty is 7 days @ 40mg followed by a week's withdrawal.

 

He was injecting Kenalog  (Triamcinolone Acetonide) Not prednisolone. Others have been prescribed the others.

Kenalog is : It is a more potent derivative of triamcinolone, and is about eight times as potent as prednisone.

Maybe that is where the confusion is coming from, we're talking about 2 different drugs.

Sorry for the confusion.

[Huddersfield]

8 hours ago, phart said:

He was injecting Kenalog  (Triamcinolone Acetonide) Not prednisolone. Others have been prescribed the others.

Kenalog is : It is a more potent derivative of triamcinolone, and is about eight times as potent as prednisone.

Maybe that is where the confusion is coming from, we're talking about 2 different drugs.

Sorry for the confusion.

No worries - I probably should read things more carefully before I jump in!!

[phart]

7 hours ago, Huddersfield said:

No worries - I probably should read things more carefully before I jump in!!

To be fair it might have been me originally mixing them up.

[phart]

Mo Farah released.
 Not much there apart from he has consistently said he has only had one TUE, yet he has either 2 or 4 of them depending on how you count.

He forgot to mention the massive shot of Triamcinolone (double wiggos dose) he had a TUE for.

"Yes I've had one TUE and that was in Park City, I collapsed on the floor, was taken in an ambulance and put on a drip. That was the only one," the 33-year-old said last year ahead of a Birmingham Diamond League meeting from which he ultimately withdrew.

Nah you forgot the prescription for the cortisoids bro. Plus you weren't even that competitive back then it was until you went to salazar.

[Parklife]

Regardless of whether they've been cheating or not, it isn't half fun to watch the GB golden children be exposed as massive liars  

[phart]

They've not been cheating. they've just been lying.

 

[Parklife]

3 minutes ago, phart said:

They've not been cheating. they've just been lying.

 

You believe that Farrah, Froome, et al are clean? 

[phart]

Article with the guy who was used to defend Froome's passport and performance as he had access to the data,

" Swart has long been involved in cycling, racing professionally on the mountainbike circuit after finishing studying medicine, and then becoming a sports scientist. He has worked with cyclists for many years and made headlines in 2015 when he carried out extensive physiological testing on Chris Froome. "

 

http://cyclingtips.com/2016/09/team-sky-tue-controversy-why-one-medical-expert-has-real-concerns/

[phart]

1 minute ago, Parklife said:

You believe that Farrah, Froome, et al are clean? 

No.

I mean this isn't a revelation about cheating the TUE's are legal, it's a revelation about liars.

Speaking specific to the leaks. I have no proof of actual cheating, i have proof they are liars though.

 

[Parklife]

1 minute ago, phart said:

I mean this isn't a revelation about cheating the TUE's are legal, it's a revelation about liars.

Yup, i know. I think you've misinterpreted what i've said. I wasn't claiming the TUE's were cheating.  

[biffer]

To be fair to Froome, his TUEs are exactly as he had previously stated they were are they not?

[phart]

42 minutes ago, biffer said:

To be fair to Froome, his TUEs are exactly as he had previously stated they were are they not?

Aye his are "benign" and more importantly completely in line with what he said.

[thplinth]

Current leader of the Tour de France Bradley Wiggins doesn't much like it when he gets grouped in with the rest of professional cycling's dopers. Asked how he feels about those accusing him and his Team Sky teammates using steroids—or whatever other high tech potions cyclists inject into themselves these days—he said they were merely trying to justify their own "bone-idleness," "because they can't ever imagine applying themselves to do anything in their lives." A sharp retort.

Oh, and he also called them "khunts" and "whankers."" Here's the full quote, tweeted out by Richard Moore (@richardmoore73):

"I say they're just fhukking whankers. I cannot be doing with people like that.

It justifies their own bone-idleness because they can't ever imagine applying themselves to do anything in their lives.

It's easy for them to sit under a pseudonym on Twitter and write that sort of shit, rather than get off their arses in their own lives and apply themselves and work hard at something and achieve something. And that's ultimately it. Khunts."

http://deadspin.com/5924278/tour-de-france-leader-bradley-wiggins-has-some-choice-words-for-anyone-who-thinks-hes-doping

Yeah the doper definitely protested too much. What a dislikable dick of a man.

edited to get round pishy swear filter

Edited September 19, 2016 by thplinth

[Denny's Yard]

11 hours ago, phart said:

Mo Farah released.
 Not much there apart from he has consistently said he has only had one TUE, yet he has either 2 or 4 of them depending on how you count.

He forgot to mention the massive shot of Triamcinolone (double wiggos dose) he had a TUE for.

"Yes I've had one TUE and that was in Park City, I collapsed on the floor, was taken in an ambulance and put on a drip. That was the only one," the 33-year-old said last year ahead of a Birmingham Diamond League meeting from which he ultimately withdrew.

Nah you forgot the prescription for the cortisoids bro. Plus you weren't even that competitive back then it was until you went to salazar.

Nah, your quote was a direct response to a question about TUEs while being coached by Salazar, as it was just after the whole NOP thing blew up.  He was saying he had only one TUE while at NOP.

Apparently there is a quote from a few weeks later where he clears that up but I haven't seen it yet.

[phart]

2 hours ago, Denny's Yard said:

Nah, your quote was a direct response to a question about TUEs while being coached by Salazar, as it was just after the whole NOP thing blew up.  He was saying he had only one TUE while at NOP.

Apparently there is a quote from a few weeks later where he clears that up but I haven't seen it yet.

Yeah i managed to get a hold of it. Cheers for the correction I wasn't aware of it. So like Froome this jives with what he said.

 “I’ve had two: I’ve had one recently in Park City and one in 2008,” Farah said. Asked whether he had applied for TUEs to help with his asthma, Farah said: “I’m not on TUE for asthma, I’m just on the normal, regular asthma [inhaler]. I just take it before exercise.”